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Sentence #119915

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Comments

WestofEden WestofEden September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 3:22:07 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

@NNC Changed it because I think it didn't make much sense.

Pfirsichbaeumchen Pfirsichbaeumchen September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 3:26:50 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

You have adopted and changed quite a number of Japanese sentences lately. Can you explain why you are doing this?

WestofEden WestofEden September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 3:29:32 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

Well, I explained it in my comment. I think the Japanese sentence didn't make much sense. Also, it has not been translated yet so now's the time to change it. The sentence was "彼が成功したのは私が努力したからだけではない。" Roughly: The reason he succeeded was not just because I worked hard. This doesn't make sense, so I tried to change it to something that's more natural.

Pfirsichbaeumchen Pfirsichbaeumchen September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 3:47:24 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

Even if you think it doesn’t make much sense or isn’t very good, you shouldn’t just adopt and change a sentence which is not in your native language. The correct course of action would be to leave a comment, possibly tag the sentence, and then wait for a native speaker to respond and take care of the matter. In any case, you should always wait before making a major change.

WestofEden WestofEden September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 5:16:43 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

Of course, it would be best if a native user adopted the sentence and changed it, but it seems that no one is willing to do that.

tommy_san tommy_san September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 6:02:13 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

I'm not really sure, but I personally don't think this matches the English.

WestofEden WestofEden September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 6:04:45 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

OK. What part doesn't match? I think I'll just unlink it for now and release the sentence.

tommy_san tommy_san September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 6:21:26 AM UTC flag Report link Permalink

とりあえずこの文自体がどれくらい自然かあまり自信ないのですが、ネイティブが「湊が努力したから成功した。」と言ったとして、ぼくの感覚ではこの「湊が」は「努力した」にのみかかり、「成功した」のが誰かは明らかではなくて、むしろ別の人だという印象を受けます。「は」は文の後の方まで、さらに別の文にまで効力を発揮するのですが、「が」の性格はもっとはるかに慎ましやかなものです。

でもこのあたりの感覚が人によってだいぶ違うのは確かなようで、bunbukuさんなどもぼくとちょっと違った使い方をなさっていたりします。
http://tatoeba.org/jpn/sentences/show/2064421
ここでは最終的にぼくの提案に合わせて直されていますが、当初「が」でもさほど違和感を抱かずに投稿されていたという事実も無視できません。
こういうことは単純に○×をつけられるものではなくて、正確な判断を下せるだけの知識はぼくにはないので、他人が書いた文章には基本的に手を触れず、自分が自然だと感じる文の投稿に徹しているのです。

WestofEden WestofEden September 8, 2013 September 8, 2013 at 3:30:09 PM UTC flag Report link Permalink

OK, thanks. I was inspired by a few sentences I saw, like:"おれは努力したから成功した→おまえは努力しなかったから失敗している。と、自称努力家はいうね。自分が成功したのは運が良かったから、周りの人に助けられたから、というひとは失敗しているように見える人にムチを打つ言葉は出さない" on Twitter. "幸運のためでなく自分が努力したから成功した", "努力したから成功した」 そう言えるかもしれませんね。 しかし。 「努力」しなければ、どうなるでしょう?", "
なので「幸運なんてものはないよ。すべては努力次第だ」という息子自身の言葉に何の重みも感じない。こういう人達はまず、自分たちが幸運に恵まれていたことに気づかなければならない。親の庇護のもと、何不自由無く好き勝手やってきた人が「努力したから成功した」とは笑止千万である。" (book review). I wonder if that last one denotes a difference in opinion between Japanese and Americans since the author was American, but I digress. It's true that these sentences were quite different so I probably shouldn't have tried to modify them. Anyway, thanks for your opinion and feel free to modify this sentence whichever way you see fit.

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License: CC BY 2.0 FR

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We cannot determine yet whether this sentence was initially derived from translation or not.

彼が成功したのは私が努力したからだけではない。

added by an unknown member, date unknown

#283901

linked by an unknown member, date unknown

#283901

unlinked by tommy_san, September 7, 2013

湊が努力したから成功した。

edited by WestofEden, September 8, 2013

#2726630

linked by WestofEden, September 8, 2013

#2726630

unlinked by WestofEden, September 8, 2013