All words in this sentence are German loan-words with the exception of "at", "og" and "var". This sentence illustrates the extent to which German loan words entered Norwegian during the Hanseatic era.

German translation please :D (Cognates where you can think of them preferred)

Please keep in mind: The language of the Hanseatic League was Low German, which is nearer to modern Dutch than to modern Standard German. That's why I recommend to add a Low Saxon and a Dutch translation too. By the way, "tøyet" reminds German "das Zeug", a word no longer in use for this meaning in modern German.

Thanks for the details.

I was uncertain about this "German" business. This is from a popular mainstream book, and nuances tend to get lost... People tend to speak of all variants of German, as simply German.

Interesting that "das Zeug" in the meaning of "tøyet" is archaic.

This Low German is called nedertysk in Norwegian as you know, but strangely this is never mentioned in mainstream discourse. They always make it sound as if "the Germans" (presumably encompassing the same people as those who speak "modern German") were the ones trading and settling in Bergen in those years.

trøye - Trøye er betegnelse for ulike typer ettersittende klesplagg som brukes for å dekke overkroppen. Trøyer kan ha varierende snitt, være korte eller lange, med eller uten ermer og knapper, og av grovt eller fint materiale. De kan dessuten være ytter- eller innerplagg, for eksempel i form av strikkejakker, gensere, trikoter, sportstrøyer og underskjorter.

"upper body garment" then - is there such a word in English that encompasses all upper-body garments?

@eirik174
Top would serve, I should think.

Is the customer complaining that he doesn't like the (deliberately)short style of the top, or that the top is too short for his own body?

To: The tailor thought that the garment fit perfectly, but the customer complained and said the top was too short and the fabric poor and coarse."

Maybe this comment really ought to be on the English sentence, but I'm responding to your comment which is on *this* page, so don't anybody yell at me! :D

I did a bit of looking at what a trøya was.

How about:
"The tailor thought the top fit perfectly, but the customer complained and said it was too short, and the fabric was poor and coarse."

(Using both "top" and "garment" in the same sentence implies that the top is only part of a larger garment. Using "top" and "it" makes it clear we are only talking about a top, nothing else.)

"This Low German is called nedertysk in Norwegian as you know, but strangely this is never mentioned in mainstream discourse. They always make it sound as if "the Germans" were the ones trading and settling in Bergen in those years."

Okey, they were Germans, but Germans living in the north of Germany (more or less) near the seacoast.

Delian, thanks for commenting.
The English and Norwegian are closely linked in all ways. It's hard to debate one without debating the other. So I wouldn't care about it too much :)

An interesting thing about trying to interpret this sentence without a context, sensible, is that the sentence itself was most likely conjured out of nothing to illustrate the presence of many German loan words in Bokmål :) But hey, it's fun.

I like the word top. I'll quote you for reference:

>> Is the customer complaining that he doesn't like the (deliberately) short style of the top, or that the top is too short for his own body?

I suppose any of those two contextual assumptions make sense :) I'd imagine his preference for longer tops is the biggest factor. The top was tailored, but of course, the tailor may have forgotten to take the relevant measure, and ended up with an inadequate product. Perhaps the customer has long arms but an unusually short upper body, and the tailor isn't used to accounting for people with non-standard body proportions.

Would this consideration affect the translation in your opinion? If you have alternative 'more precise' translations according to those different assumptions about the customer's reaction, please do add those sentences :)

Low Saxon and Dutch translations wanted pleeeeeeeeease! Cookies will be awarded.

Your Norwegian "skredder" reminds me of the English "shredder". :P

If you knew Teenage Mutant Hero Turtles as a child,
I used to think the villain Shredder was actually called "Skredder" - as such I wondered what his connection to the tailoring profession was.

@eirik174

In response to your query, *first* some general things that would be natural for an English speaker to say in that situation. (Not trying to rephrase the original sentence).

If the customer didn't like the style of the top, which had been made short on purpose, he could say things like:

I don't care for this style. It's too short for my liking.

I don't like the short style. I prefer them longer.

Wow, this is shorter than I thought it was going to be.
It leaves my belly hanging out. ;)


On the other hand, if the top wasn't *intended* to be too short:

Oh, what happened here? Got the measurement wrong?

Are you sure this is mine?

I think this must be somebody else's top.


Now to that sentence:

The tailor thought that the top fit perfectly, but the customer complained, saying the style was too short for his liking and the fabric was poor and coarse.

The tailor thought that the top fit perfectly, but the customer complained, saying it was obviously sewn too short and the fabric was poor and coarse.

Actually, "the fabric was poor and coarse" is correct, but not very natural-sounding. More likely:

...the fabric wasn't good quality.
...the fabric was rather shoddy.

Does that help, or just overwhelm you?
Be careful what you ask for. :D

Thanks Delian.

I'd like to preserve this sentence as-is because I think it preserves the ambiguity inherent in the original Norwegian sentence which, really does not belong in a real existing context, nor really to a fictional one, but was construed to illustrate Low German influence on Norwegian :)

But I have added and linked your suggestions to the English sentence, as interpretations / improvements on it. The sentence as is, is definitely quaint, kind of oldfashioned. So now we have modern-day versions :)

Well you see, the whole point for me with adding the English, is to compare the languages' lexicon. And the sentence works in English I think - whether it's archaic-sounding or not, that's besides the point :) But I can't expect other people to 'agree' with this, or have prior knowledge. Tatoeba does have historic quotes, and there is no rule that sentences must be modern English I think.

This poem uses exactly 'fabric poor and coarse':

My garb is plain —
Of fabric poor, and coarse, my well-worn coat —

Source:
http://www.ebooksread.com/autho...mian-goo.shtml

I didn't add any sentence(s) yet, but you are of course free to add as many interpretations/improvements of my English sentences as you like :)