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例文#322943

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コメント

ajje ajje 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 20:23:15 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

I don't think this is right.

DJ_Saidez DJ_Saidez 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 21:21:48 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

I think it's maybe ok, just archaic (quite = often), but it doesn't match the Japanese.

Pfirsichbaeumchen Pfirsichbaeumchen 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 21:24:59 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Maybe it's an attempt to translate the Japanese too literally. How about "I've completely forgotten your name"? It would match the Russian. I suspect it would also match the Chinese.

@JimBreen
@Yorwba

Pfirsichbaeumchen Pfirsichbaeumchen 2021年10月6日, 編集 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 21:28:38 UTC, 編集 2021年10月6日 21:30:48 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

I'm not sure it even matches the Japanese. お名前 would seem more fitting for "your name", especially since it's in desu/masu style.

@small_snow
@bunbuku

Yorwba Yorwba 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 21:29:22 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Yeah, "I've completely forgotten your name." matches the Chinese sentence. I've linked it.

Yorwba Yorwba 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 21:39:05 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Using GutenSearch https://gutensearch.com/ I found a similar example in a book from 1897: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/...-h/37337-h.htm

"Then pray let us adopt the Duke's suggestion, and play a foursome to-morrow—like as we sit. Eh, Mr.—I beg your pardon, but I quite forget your name?"

"Dalrymple," replied the squatter; "and yours, once more?"

JimBreen JimBreen 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 22:31:30 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

"I quite forget ..." is a common English formation. It might sound a little old-fashioned, but it's OK. As a translation of "名前をすっかり忘れてしまいました。" probably "I've completely forgotten your name." is probably better.

sundown sundown 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 22:35:53 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Yep, it does mean "I've completely forgotten your name". It's the sort of thing you hear come from the mouths of upper-class characters in period dramas.

JimBreen JimBreen 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 22:38:10 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

It's what I say. Maybe I'm an upper-class character in a period drama.

Pfirsichbaeumchen Pfirsichbaeumchen 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 22:51:52 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Perhaps you'd like to adopt the sentence? :)

small_snow small_snow 2021年10月6日, 編集 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 22:54:17 UTC, 編集 2021年10月6日 22:56:29 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

@sumdown @JimBreen
I have a question. Please tell me more.
Are you saying that this English sentence is more likely to be said by someone from the upper-class to someone who has a lower position?

sundown sundown 2021年10月6日, 編集 2021年10月8日 2021年10月6日 23:03:55 UTC, 編集 2021年10月8日 7:36:30 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

@JimBreen

After I'd written that, I did think that I could imagine it being said by all kinds of older people (no offence meant).

JimBreen JimBreen 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 23:29:05 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Well, I'm 74 so maybe I'm more likely to use old-fashioned expressions.
@small_snow It's an old-fashioned expression, and hence more likely to be said by an older person (e.g. me) or by someone who has been exposed to literature written some time ago. As "upper class" sometimes equates to "has had more education", I guess that's what's behind @sundown's comment.
Isn't it a bit the same in Japan. I'm sure there are expressions found in Sōseki and Akutagawa that are not in everyday use now.

small_snow small_snow 2021年10月6日 2021年10月6日 23:51:09 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

@JimBreen
Thank you for your detailed explanation.
I understand very well. :)

JimBreen JimBreen 2021年10月7日 2021年10月7日 0:26:06 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

As suggested by - I quite forget the name - I have adopted the sentence.

small_snow small_snow 2021年10月7日 2021年10月7日 0:39:42 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

@Pfirsichbaeumchen
>I'm not sure it even matches the Japanese.
I think so, too. Because I think the Japanese sentence[#80772] sounds rude to say to the person in front of me. I might say it in the third person, or to things. Then I maybe use お名前 for a third person, as you say.
- その方の(お)名前をすっかり忘れてしまいました。
- その花の名前をすっかり忘れてしまいました。

So, to me, this combination of English and Japanese seems a little bit strange. My friend which I asked said, "I think the 'completely' part makes it like 'I'm sorry, but...'"
Instead of translating the word "completely" as "すっかり", maybe it'd be better or more appropriate to translate it as another Japanese sentence, but, I'm not sure. Thank you.

JimBreen JimBreen 2021年10月7日 2021年10月7日 22:03:57 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

I don't have a problem with すっかり忘れて.. - it's quite common. I'm more concerned with the plain 名前. I think for it to work with "your name" it needs to be お名前.

Pfirsichbaeumchen Pfirsichbaeumchen 2021年10月8日 2021年10月8日 6:57:52 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Maybe we should unlink the Japanese? Another option would be that small_snow changes the Japanese to something that matches "I quite forget your name" (we'd take care of the links that would have to be separated).

Which would you prefer?

CK CK 2021年10月8日 2021年10月8日 7:50:24 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

> ... but it doesn't match the Japanese.

It seems to match to me.

small_snow small_snow 2021年10月8日, 編集 2021年10月8日 2021年10月8日 10:54:54 UTC, 編集 2021年10月8日 11:02:06 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

@JimBreen

>I don't have a problem with すっかり忘れて.. - it's quite common.
I'm sure すっかり忘れて is quite common. But, I think it's a quite rude phrase to me. So I would never say to someone *in front of me*, "(あなたのお)名前をすっかり忘れてしまいました," and I would feel bad if someone did. Because I think the meaning of the Japanese sentence すっかり忘れていた is "even never crossed my mind" or "It wasn't even in the corner of my head."

That's why I asked you the following question is:
Are you saying that this English sentence is more likely to be said by someone from the upper-class to someone who has a lower position?

(Because) I thought it might be a possibility if a superior were to say it. However, you didn't answer "Yes."

And then I asked my friend who is an English native speaker, "Doesn't it make you feel bad to be told this sentence(I've completely forgotten your name.)? He said "No. I think the 'completely' part makes it like 'I'm sorry, but...'" So, I felt this combination of English and Japanese seems a little bit strange.
By the way, I think if I would translate it I will translate the Japanese sentence into English like the following sentences:
I've completely forgotten its name.
I quite forget its name.
But I'm not sure whether those are natural or unnatural.

> I'm more concerned with the plain 名前. I think for it to work with "your name" it needs to be お名前.
To be honest, in this case, I think either 名前 or お名前 would be fine. Because I don't think it's necessary(always and always; 必ずしも) to translate "your name" as お名前(I think 名前 is also ok), and although the end of the sentence is politely worded, the phrase すっかり忘れて give the rude impression for me. I think so, but I don’t know what other people think. Thank you.

Lastly, I apologize for my poor English. I hope you understand what I'm trying to say. Also, I apologize in advance if there are any rude expressions in my English.

@Pfirsichbaeumchen
I was just trying to answer your question in a straightforward(frankly) manner. The Japanese sentence is fine, so I think we can wait until someone else is adopted. Sorry, I could not help you.

JimBreen JimBreen 2021年10月8日 2021年10月8日 23:10:44 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

@small_snow
Thank you very much for the information about すっかり忘れて; I didn't know it was considered rude. The English "I'd quite forgotten ..." is neutral and can be used in many contexts, e.g. "I'd quite forgotten to take salt and pepper to the picnic.".

I like your suggested "I've completely forgotten its name." In the context, it's probably better than the version I added, so I will amend it.

small_snow small_snow 2021年10月9日 2021年10月9日 3:39:07 UTC flag Report link 固定リンク

Thank you for your response, @JimBreen :)

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I quite forget your name.

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