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Soru sormadan önce SSS'yi okuduğunuzdan emin olun.

Wall (984 threads)

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sinthiayuliani
an hour ago
Hola❤❤❤❤❤
Pfirsichbaeumchen
an hour ago - düzenlendi an hour ago
-----------------------------------------------------
New Advanced Contributor Request
Neue Bewerbung zum fortgeschr. Mitarbeiter
Nova peto por iĝi progresinta kontribuanto
-----------------------------------------------------

Cueyayotl: http://tatoeba.org/deu/user/profile/cueyayotl.

[ENG] Cueyayotl has requested advanced contributor status. Please feel free to tell us your opinion. Send us a message using link below.

Advanced contributors can link and tag sentences.

[DEU] Cueyayotl möchte fortgeschrittener Mitarbeiter werden. Zögert nicht, uns Eure Meinung mitzuteilen. Schickt uns eine Nachricht mit Hilfe der untenstehenden Verknüpfung.

Fortgeschrittene Mitarbeiter können Sätze verknüpfen und etikettieren.

[EPO] Cueyayotl deziras iĝi progresinta kontribuanto. Ni petas, ke vi ne hezitu sciigi nin pri via opinio. Sendu al ni mesaĝon per la suba ligilo.

Progresintaj kontribuantoj povas ligi frazojn kaj aldoni etikedojn.

[1] http://tatoeba.org/eng/private_...sichbaeumchen.
CK
CK
yesterday
Is it correct to use 2 different sets of characters to write Khmer on tatoeba.org?

http://tatoeba.org/eng/sentence.../cueyayotl/khm

I know that we don't allow Japanese sentences to be contributed in Romaji here.

If there are indeed 2 different correct ways to write Khmer, perhaps we should have them designated as different languages.

Do we have native speakers here who represent the 2 ways?
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odexed
yesterday
Maybe these comments would be helpful for this thread:

#3773490
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cueyayotl
22 hours ago
I've discussed this with my wife (a native Khmer speaker), and we both agree that the Khmer script is inadequate to properly transcribe the spoken language as opposed to the royal language (which the characters represent). On some occasions the sentences are similar enough to not need a separate translation into spoken speech, but there are certain utterances that will confuse learners of the language, such as the numbers being different (the spoken '6', sounds like '1' as it is represented in writing).

As for separating them into two languages... I'm torn. I felt that as long as the Khmer script version is linked with the Roman script version, it is okay. But separating into Standard Khmer and... (maybe) Dialectical Khmer could work too.
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CK
CK
21 hours ago
1. Is your method of transcribing spoken language standard and something native speakers use?

2. If the answer to question 1 is yes, then, is this transcription method considered less desirable?

3. Is the opinion that you and your wife share something most Khmer native speakers share?

4. If the answer to question 3, is yes, then, do they also write Khmer this way?

5. Are there native speakers of Khmer that only write in this alternate way?

6. Is this alternate way of writing something that teachers recommend that those learning Khmer learn instead of the standard way of writing?

7. Are there books, newspapers, and magazine written in this alternate writing system you are using?

8. (The original question rephrased:) Should we really be using 2 different sets of characters to write Khmer on tatoeba.org?
nGerman
yesterday
Hey all,

registered here a moment ago and this is my short introduction: I'm from germany, as you might guess and my english is not so good, but i hope i'll be able to contribute in german language...

Tatoeba sounds like a great project to me, so I hope we will work together in a productive way and i will find much time to spend here :)

Best, ngerman
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TRANG
yesterday
Welcome to Tatoeba :)
Hybrid
yesterday
Welcome to Tatoeba. Willkommen bei Tatoeba. There are many German users here and they're very nice :)
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nGerman
yesterday
Thanks you two! :) I already discussed with a few other users and everyone is really friendly!! But what really makes me happy is the CC-BY! That's a great thing you created here, Trang!!
Aleksandro40
5 days ago
Milyen legyen az idegen nyelvű mondat magyar fordítása? Kövessük-e amennyire lehet az eredeti mondat kifejezési formáit, vagy legyen olyan a fordítás, mintha azt eredetileg is magyarul fogalmazták volna meg? Van olyan kritikus, aki hol azt kifogásolja, hogy a lefordított mondatban nincsen benne az eredeti minden szavának magyar megfelelője, hol meg azt kifogásolja, hogy a már eredetileg is sután megfogalmazott mondat magyar fordítása nem üti meg az irodalmi színvonalat. A műfordító hozott anyagból dolgozik, bodzafából nehéz mahagónit faragni. Különálló mondatokat egyébként is nehéz fordítani, mert nem ismerjük a szövegkörnyezetet. Legyen jó nyelvtanilag az új mondat és tartalmazza azokat az információkat, melyeket az eredeti mondat megfogalmazója közölni akart. Aki Makóra akart menni, ne kössön ki Jeruzsálemben a fordításunk alapján. Ez az én véleményem. És a tiétek?
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mraz
yesterday
@Aleksandro40, Amit leírtál, abban benne van a válasz:

" Milyen legyen az idegennyelvű mondat magyar fordítása? "

AZAZ

Milyen legyen az adott mondat bármilyen nyelvű fordítása?


"Legyen jó nyelvtanilag az új mondat, és tartalmazza azokat az információkat, melyeket az eredeti mondat megfogalmazója közölni akart."

és

" ....legyen olyan a fordítás, mintha azt eredetileg is magyarul fogalmazták volna meg."

A fenti két gondolat együtt érvényes!

Azonkívül jó lenne, ha

"...a már eredetileg is sután megfogalmazott mondat" -ot nem fordítaná le senki!

Remélem sokan megértik és betartják a tanácsomat!

Jó munkát kívánok! mraz

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mraz
yesterday - düzenlendi yesterday
Ime egy példa az utóbbira: #3814738

zu posieren ---> pózol (pózoláshoz), testtartást vesz fel (hogy felvegyenek egy testtartást),

modellt ül (hogy modellt üljön), színészkedik (hogy színészkedjen),

Szabad ezt lefordítani?

(Az nem baj, ha a mondat jelentését anyanyelvű "eredeti" mondatnak hozzáadjuk.)
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mraz
yesterday
@Aleksandro40, Mi a véleményed?
TRANG
yesterday
** Tatoeba update (January 31st, 2015) **

http://blog.tatoeba.org/2015/01...31st-2015.html


# UI Improvements

* We changed the position of the language icons. It is now displayed on the left of the sentence.
* The link/unlink button (accessible only for advanced contributors) is displayed between the language icon and the sentence's text.
* A button to hide/show replies on the Wall has been added.


# Empty search

Searching for an empty string would redirect you to a message saying "Please enter a nonempty search string".
The search feature has been modified so that searching an empty string will instead display all the sentences.

This feature works also with the language filters, so you can search for <nothing> from Bulgarian, and it will display all the sentences in Bulgarian. You can as well search <nothing> from Bulgarian to English, and it will display all the sentences in Bulgarian that have a translation in English.

Note that there is still a limitation of 1000 results. The count will display the total number of results but you will not be able to browse through all the results, only the 1000 first ones.
RU
RU
2 days ago
Look at the language selection menu. It's only русский that is not capitalized. Is that sort of discrimination or something?
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Impersonator
2 days ago - düzenlendi yesterday
If we were to discriminate against Russian speakers, why would we translate the interface into Russian in the first place? +_+

I don’t know why the language names are written inconsistently, probably because no one bothered to make them consistent. Russian generally starts language names with a lowercase letter, so it’s not incorrect, just inconsistent with other menu items, — such things are not always easy to spot when translating.
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TRANG
yesterday
What would be the capitalized version? We can easily fix that.

Nobody in the dev team speaks Russian so if our users don't notice any inconsistency, we won't know at all.
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Impersonator
yesterday
> What would be the capitalized version?

Русский
sacredceltic
yesterday
Les noms des langues sont également incorrects en français, où ils devraient être en minuscules...
J'ai l'impression que cette liste ne sera jamais correcte...
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gillux
yesterday
J’ai mis des majuscules dans cette liste car ce sont des éléments d’une liste. Tout comme les boutons, titres, éléments de menus etc. je pense qu’ils devraient comporter une majuscule. La minuscule peut se défendre aussi, cela dit.
carlosalberto
yesterday
Kara Alexander!

Ni ĉiuj volas, ke vi tuj resaniĝu, por baldaŭ reveni kun via inteligenteco kaj kapablo al nia kunvivado.
cueyayotl
yesterday
3 more members have asked me that why I do not have Advanced Contributor status, and it is difficult to answer anymore.

I understand that the issue before was that I was contributing in too many languages (even though all of my contributions were from friends who are native speakers). I have since then let all of my sentences in other languages go. The only exceptions are Conlangs, Khmer (which I will give to my wife in April/May this year), Korean (I'm looking for someone here in South Korea where I live to take care of the Korean; I am an official Korean-Spanish translator and know that if I let my sentences go, a non-native will take them...I prefer somebody I trust to take over them. The Korean-language situation is complicated here in Tatoeba), English (for similar reasons as Korean), and Unknown Language (though I gave some of them up, I keep some for the hope that someday a native contributor will come, and the languages will be added).

I have browsed through and labeled all of the sentences in unknown languages, with ISO 639-3 Code, so if you see a sentence in an unknown language here on Tatoeba, you will know it's situation (whether it is simply an error, or if it is a real language, and if so, which language it is).

The one task I am finding to be increasingly necessary to do, is to be able to link sentences. Every time I see a sentence in Spanish that needs to be linked, I write it down into a Wordpad document, but it has gotten very large. I feel that I am wasting other people's time by asking them to link sentences, when I could be doing the work for myself. I would love people from all over the world to be able to learn my language, but it is difficult when, for example, sentences from Spanish to German are only indirectly linked and 'du' 'Sie' and 'ihr' forms are connected freely to 'tú' 'vos' 'usted' 'ustedes' 'vosotros' forms without distinction. I am completely able and willing to take on this task, to develop the Tatoeba Project into the universal tool for language learning that it is meant to be, and advance cross-cultural understanding.

I think that I have proven my utmost dedication to the Tatoeba Project, its value to my wife's life and my own, and the great part it will play in our lives as we travel and learn new languages and cultures... so I once again humbly request the status of advanced contributor.

Thank you and let's keep working hard on the Tatoeba Project!
Cueyāyōtl

P.S. I know that last time people got angry at me because they thought that I was requesting Corpus Maintainer status before being an Advanced Contributor, and it made me seem rather ambitious and zealous. But, it was not my idea at all. It was simply TRANG's suggestion.
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Pfirsichbaeumchen
yesterday
I've received your message, and I'll answer it shortly. Please be patient just a little while longer.
TRANG
4 days ago
I would need people to test a couple of things on http://dev.tatoeba.org.

1) I have added a button to show/hide replies on the Wall. Please let me know how you feel about it. Is it confusing to use? If you feel it could be improved, how would you improve it?

2) For advanced contributors: I have moved the link/unlink button next to the language icon. Is this better?

Thanks.
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AlanF_US
4 days ago
I like both changes.
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sharptoothed
4 days ago
+1
tommy_san
4 days ago
I like them, too.
Maybe the scissors should be mirror-reversed. We shouldn't cut flags into pieces.
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sabretou
4 days ago
I was thinking of this myself. +1
CK
CK
4 days ago - düzenlendi 4 days ago
I like having the unlinking far way from the link.

I think on the Wall, "show/hide replies" needs to share the same link color as the other links on the page, instead of having the same color as the text of Wall postings. Or, maybe it can be made to look like a button. That way, it would be more intuitive.
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TRANG
4 days ago
I've added some borders to the "hide replies" button.
Shishir
4 days ago
yes, it's way more comfortable to click on the links without having to worry about unlinking the sentence :) Thanks Trang!
gillux
4 days ago
I like the hide/reply buttons on Wall messages.

With the scissors on the right, the flag now seems a little bit out of place to me, because it’s between two buttons. I think it’s important to group buttons/icons in a meaningful way: information about the sentence (flag), link to the sentence, actions you can perform on the sentence (audio and link/unlink). So I suggest putting the flag on the top right or top left.
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CK
CK
4 days ago
... or move the linking tools to the right side of the flag.
TRANG
4 days ago
I moved the language icon to the right. My only fear is that people will now mistakenly click on link/unlink when they want to listen to audio. But this should happen less often than mistakenly link/unlink when wanting to go to the sentence's page.
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CK
CK
4 days ago - düzenlendi 4 days ago
This is another order you could try.

sentence - audio - flag - linking tools


However, I think the way you had it before was OK.

sentence - linking tools - flag - audio
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tommy_san
3 days ago
Another possibility is:

arrow - flag - sentence - linking tools - audio.

I think it's better to position the flags next to the sentences.
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CK
CK
3 days ago - düzenlendi 3 days ago
I like this idea, too.

People who use this website are used to seeing the flag in front of the sentences on the home page already, so this would also help standardize the user interface.



Perhaps while you are making changes, other standardization of the UI would be helpful, too.

Currently, to go to a sentence we have at least 3 different ways visitors to the website have to learn.

1. On the home page in "Latest contributions", we have to click either the sentence number or the time the item was submitted.

2. On the home page in "Latest comments", we have to click the sentence. (This is also the way "View Comments on a Certain Member's Sentences" works. http://tatoeba.org/eng/sentence..._of_user/TRANG)

3. On each sentence's page, in "browse sentences", "browse tags", etc., we have to click an icon.
TRANG
3 days ago
> I think it's better to position the flags next to the sentences.

Yes, that's something I've wanted to do for several months. But it won't be for right now. The idea I have in mind will take a bit more time to implement.

The idea is basically to display only the flag, sentence text and audio initially.
And on rollover, display the arrow button and the link/unlink button.
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tommy_san
3 days ago - düzenlendi 3 days ago
I'm not sure if you got me right, and I'm not sure if I like your idea. Does it mean that the sentences will often move up and down?

Here's what I had in mind.
http://prntscr.com/5yhsd8
These scissors actually look strange to me, though (cf. http://tatoeba.org/wall/show_me...#message_21652).
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TRANG
3 days ago
I understood you properly.

In my idea the sentences won't move up and down. Everything will stay at the same place, it's just that certain elements will appear or disappear based on rollover.
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CK
CK
3 days ago
Is it possible to change the background color behind the sentence depending on what icon the mouse is over?

For example, can the background be a very light pink when the cursor is over the scissors, and maybe a very light blue when over the link icon?

If so, perhaps the chance of accidentally unlinking would be much less.

Right now, the change in background color when the cursor is over the sentence, implies that if you click at that time, you'll be able to go to the sentence. That's how it often works on other websites, so it's a bit confusing at first.
Pfirsichbaeumchen
2 days ago
>>> Here's what I had in mind.
>>> http://prntscr.com/5yhsd8

That looks pretty good. I like that.

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CK
CK
2 days ago - düzenlendi 2 days ago
>>> Here's what I had in mind.
>>> http://prntscr.com/5yhsd8

This still doesn't solve the problem that TRANG mentioned.
"My only fear is that people will now mistakenly click on link/unlink when they want to listen to audio."

Perhaps this order might solve that.

arrow - flag - audio - sentence - linking tools

And maybe don't even show the audio icon if no audio exists for a sentence.
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Pfirsichbaeumchen
2 days ago - düzenlendi 2 days ago
This would be yet another possibility: http://prntscr.com/5yt2er.

P.S. There'll probably be problems with very long sentences. Perhaps it is also time to think about how to align them best.
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TRANG
yesterday
I initially wanted to leave it as
[arrow] [text] [link button] [audio] [lang]
to see if people would click on the link button by mistake while they wanted to listen to audio.

But I think your suggested positioning is more worth a try. We'll go with it for the next update and see if users have any trouble.
Ooneykcall
4 days ago
Both changes appear to be quite convenient, thank you.
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