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This sentence was initially added as a translation of sentence #969450Dick essaya en vain de résoudre le problème..

Wrench tried in vain to solve the problem.

added by sacredceltic, July 1, 2011

Sentence #969554

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Comments

sacredceltic sacredceltic June 2, 2013 June 2, 2013 at 11:53:19 PM UTC link Permalink

Dick is a stupid name.

sacredceltic sacredceltic June 3, 2013 June 3, 2013 at 12:02:20 AM UTC link Permalink

I think it would improve the Corpus if example sentences in any language featured names that would be identifiable in the language. « Dick » is not only silly in English, it is also unidentifiable in French. Do you understand ?

sharptoothed sharptoothed June 3, 2013 June 3, 2013 at 11:13:49 AM UTC link Permalink

"Dick" is not only a first name (quite a common nickname for Richard in English no matter how stupidly it sounds) but also a surname
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Li...h_surname_Dick

About the name identifiability. "Tom" is being commonly used in Russian example sentences though this name is hardly identifiable in Russian. Is it a good reason to start translating it from Russian as "volume" or "tome" just because we can do this?

sacredceltic sacredceltic June 3, 2013 June 3, 2013 at 12:29:49 PM UTC link Permalink

I was the one to propose a solution to use generic tags for firstnames that would be automatically and randomly filled with a list of valid common - and recognizable - names in each language, thus solving a double problem :

1) avoid false duplicates in the same language, in which just the name changes suche as :
Dick is an idiot / Rick is an idiot
2) avoid having sentences where names are not identidfiable as such in the language.
For instance : "Olyengurf is brilliant !"

What is "Olyengurf" ? A company ? A brand ? An association ? An administration ? A person ?
Nobody can tell, because "Olyengurf" is not a recognizable name in English.

But nobody listened.
The result is the multiplication of silly sentences with silly names in different languages.
This sentence was a protest against that result. My protest is still going on.

Anyway, there is no rule that governs people's names, and this sentence could be about a company named "Wrench" which actually exists : http://www.wrench.com.au/

sharptoothed sharptoothed June 3, 2013 June 3, 2013 at 1:19:42 PM UTC link Permalink

> I was the one to propose a solution to use generic tags for
> firstnames that would be automatically and randomly filled
> with a list of valid common - and recognizable - names

This sounds reasonable in my opinion. It seems that most languages (if not every) have their own placeholder names and words for many things including given/first names. I'm not sure if it's a good idea to use random placeholder name every time since the choice of a particular name can differ depending on context or usage case. But I think it's possible to encourage members to use placeholder names in their sentences whenever it makes sense. Naturally, all members should be aware about this policy so it should be reflected in Tatoeba rules.

sacredceltic sacredceltic June 3, 2013 June 3, 2013 at 1:37:22 PM UTC link Permalink

I know there are difficulties with some languages.
For instance, in French, we have an elision in front of vowels and mute "h" :

C'est la voiture de Pierre
C'est la voiture d'Alain

and of course we would have to consider gender.
But I think it is possible to overcome these difficulties with a minimum of procedures.

In any case, it would be much better than blindly copying silly US names that make no sense in most other languages.
It's even worse with the transcription of japanese names, most of which cannot be identified as people's names and can't be distinguished from brands or company names.
examples :
Kumiko is a person name
but
Shiseido is a brand

How do I know that if I'm interested neither in Japanese culture or products ?

Reversely, japanese people use suffixes for people's names : sharptoothed-san

But what can you do if you don't know whether the name is for a person or a brand ? Michelin-san ??? Vuitton-san ???

sharptoothed sharptoothed June 3, 2013 June 3, 2013 at 2:22:43 PM UTC link Permalink

I think this topic worth being raised on the Wall. We do need a collective decision.

sacredceltic sacredceltic June 3, 2013 June 3, 2013 at 2:27:25 PM UTC link Permalink

I raised it on the wall, at the time (maybe 2 years ago), to no avail...I think many people don't see the point although they complain about near-duplicates clogging the Corpus...