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掲示板(スレッド数:5,770)

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質問をする際は、必ずあらかじめよくある質問をお読みください。

なお、Tatoebaは文明的な討論を行うために健全な雰囲気を維持することを目指しています。悪質な行為に対するルールも併せてお読みください。

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JimBreen JimBreen 2010年3月21日 6:11 2010年3月21日 6:11 link permalink

Traditional and Simplified Chinese

I saw the comment about converting hanzi on-the-fly. Be very cautious about that, as there are many cases where it simply doesn't work. Proper Traditional<->Simplified conversion needs to work at the lexeme level and in some cases needs some context for disambiguation.

Jack Halpern wrote a very good paper about this about 10 years ago:
http://www.cjk.org/cjk/c2c/c2cbasis.htm

PS: how do I make a comment on another posting?

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JimBreen JimBreen 2010年3月21日 6:40 2010年3月21日 6:40 link permalink

OK, I worked out how to do a follow-on. I'd clicked "reply" but it hadn't worked. Now it does.

sysko sysko 2010年3月21日 11:10 2010年3月21日 11:10 link permalink

the traditional to simplified chinese is not made at "character by character" level, but try to decompose the sentence (you can see how the sentence has been segmented by looking to pinyin)
As I've said I'm in conctact with the guy who develop it, so don't hesitate to report any bad segmentations, I will report to him

blay_paul blay_paul 2010年3月2日 11:46 2010年3月2日 11:46 link permalink

WWWJDIC index line.

I suggest adding links from words in the Japanese sentence to WWWJDIC entries using the information in the index line. That would be a useful 'first step' towards adding furigana to the sentence.

The basic set-up is relatively straight forward, but there is one complication - namely 'deliberately non-indexed text'. Punctuation, English words, place names and other proper nouns are not generally included in EDICT and so do not have entries in the Index line. Jim Breen should have a 'no index' field that includes all non-indexed text (although it may not be up to date). In order to parse a sentence properly you need both the index line and the non-indexed text.

Adding furigana to place names etc. should probably be left for later.

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JimBreen JimBreen 2010年3月21日 6:39 2010年3月21日 6:39 link permalink

Word-by-word links based on the Japanese index words would be good, and not too hard to implement, I think.

At present I am pulling the sentences and indices into WWWJDIC once a week, and I put them through a utility which matches the text and the index contents, and reports if there is a mismatch (which usually means that someone has changed a sentence.) To get around the problem of "deliberately non-indexed text" I have a file of
words which I ignore if they are not in the index. You can see this list of words at http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~...amplestopwords (in EUC-JP). Most are names. Some look a bit odd as they are two or more names which had been separated by punctuation (which I ignore.)

blay_paul blay_paul 2010年3月20日 19:20 2010年3月20日 19:20 link permalink

Translation suggestions

There are now 100 translation suggestions waiting to be checked at
https://translations.launchpad..../ja/+translate

I would urge people who understand Japanese to check them and either confirm or correct them.

blay_paul blay_paul 2010年3月19日 18:02 2010年3月19日 18:02 link permalink

Source Code?

In order to better determine possible translations for
https://translations.launchpad..../ja/+translate
it would help if I could view the source code.

Also, some translation items require code reworking as well. e.g. "linked to" should probably be "linked to » %s" (where %s is the sentence number) so that the Japanese could be something like "%s とつながる".

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TRANG TRANG 2010年3月20日 13:09 2010年3月20日 13:09 link permalink

Normally the path of the file should be enough of a hint for you to figure out on which page of the website the string can be found.

If the path is something like /views/<something>/file.ctp file, then you would usually (not always) need to go to http://tatoeba.org/<something>/file

If the path is /controllers/<something>_controller.php, then the string is a bit harder to find, but it can be found somewhere in the pages that start with http://tatoeba.org/<something>/

I don't know how comfortable you are looking at source code, but it could be simpler if you just translated what you can first. We have a "test" version of Tatoeba where we test things before we update the "real" version of Tatoeba. As soon as you have your translations done (even partially), we can update the "test" version and you can then browse around in there to check if the translations fit or not. I'll give you the link in a private message.

Other than that, the source code can be found here:
http://subversion.assembla.com/...ba2/trunk/app/
Just note that the strings in Launchpad are not always exactly synchronized with the code source.

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blay_paul blay_paul 2010年3月20日 14:34 2010年3月20日 14:34 link permalink

> I don't know how comfortable you are looking at source code

Reasonably. I'm familiar with Visual Basic, Javascript and Visual Basic - PhP is like the bastard offspring of all of those.

Without looking at the code it's very difficult to correctly translate things like

<b>Share</b> your knowledge.

because they are handled as _two strings_ and the order needs to be reversed in Japanese.

<b>知識</b>を共有する

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TRANG TRANG 2010年3月20日 14:40 2010年3月20日 14:40 link permalink

Ah yes, forgot to mention, like you noted, there are some strings that we forgot to make more "compliant" for internationalization.

You can send me an email to list those you find. I'll fix it in the code and update the strings in Launchpad.

saeb saeb 2010年3月18日 19:21 2010年3月18日 19:21 link permalink

Question, which places more strain on the server: generating sentences using a keyword query or using the random sentence generator?

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sysko sysko 2010年3月19日 9:45 2010年3月19日 9:45 link permalink

random sentences for sure, mysql doesn't like random at all ^^ we're on the way to try to make it faster

jaystarkey jaystarkey 2010年3月15日 21:58 2010年3月15日 21:58 link permalink

Would be really cool if we could add audio someday to the example sentences ;-)

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sysko sysko 2010年3月16日 11:38 2010年3月16日 11:38 link permalink

We plan to do so, you will have more details and maybe a proof of concet at the beginning of April :)

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Swift Swift 2010年3月28日 11:30 2010年3月28日 11:30 link permalink

Looking forward to that!

Wolf Wolf 2010年3月15日 0:25 2010年3月15日 0:25 link permalink

Did you change something with the database dump? This Saturday's jpn_indices contain invalid utf8 characters and the affected lines seem to be truncated.

The following sentence ids have problems: 83767, 91272, 140460, 146080, 152054, 190707, 195118, 199753, 205628, 211131, 213530, 235850

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TRANG TRANG 2010年3月15日 18:46 2010年3月15日 18:46 link permalink

Ah, indeed, indeed. I had changed the 'text' field from varchar to varbinary, but kept the length to 500. That's why those entries were truncated. I've fixed it and did a new export of the jpn_indices.


> This Saturday's jpn_indices [...]

How do you know about that by the way? I don't remember making it official yet, that the download files would be upadted on Saturdays. (or did I? o.o)

saeb saeb 2010年3月13日 17:34 2010年3月13日 17:34 link permalink

1000+ sentences in arabic.

I'd like 2 thank everyone that has ever thanked everyone. On behalf of all of us you've thanked I say thank u for thanking us.

lol dane cook is brilliant :D

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MUIRIEL MUIRIEL 2010年3月14日 11:51 2010年3月14日 11:51 link permalink

:D thank you^^.

saeb saeb 2010年3月13日 17:30 2010年3月13日 17:30 link permalink

I believe in ghosts. I believe in aliens. But theres no way u will ever persuade me into believing in alien ghosts. Ridiculous.

I believe in the sentence method. I believe in language websites. But theres no way u will ever persuade me into believing in sentence websites. Ridiculous

yay! first tatoeba joke :P (hmm I wonder if I can consider this a wall abuse..)

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saeb saeb 2010年3月13日 17:49 2010年3月13日 17:49 link permalink

TRANG says:

omg you're so funny, stop "abusing" the wall :D

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TRANG TRANG 2010年3月14日 12:04 2010年3月14日 12:04 link permalink

I should just mention I never said that :P
But I do think it. Well, especially the "abusing the wall" part, because now I'm working on figuring out how to paginate this wall. Certainly there will be more abuse.

TRANG TRANG 2010年3月13日 12:17 2010年3月13日 12:17 link permalink

Just wanted to let everyone know, Tatoeba has been updated.

http://blog.tatoeba.org/2010/03...13th-2010.html

Enjoy :)