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Here you can ask general questions like how to use Tatoeba, report bugs or strange behavior, or simply socialize with the rest of the community.

Before asking a question, make sure to read the FAQ.

Wall (4565 threads)

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Pfirsichbaeumchen
4 days ago
Camilo (baudelaire) would like to become an advanced contributor/möchte fortgeschrittener Mitarbeiter werden/deziras iĝi progresinta kontribuanto.

https://tatoeba.org/user/profile/baudelaire

[ENG] Please feel free to send us a message and share your opinion. You can use the linke below. Advanced contributors help us link and tag sentences.

[DEU] Schickt uns mit Hilfe der am Ende eingefügten Verknüpfung eine Nachricht und teilt uns Eure Meinung mit. Fortgeschrittene Mitarbeiter helfen uns beim Verknüpfen und Etikettieren von Sätzen.

[EPO] Ni petas, ke vi ne hezitu sendi al ni privatan mesaĝon per la suba ligilo kaj diri al nia vian opinion. La progresintaj kontribuantoj helpas al ni ligi kaj etikedigi frazojn.

[1] http://tatoeba.org/private_mess...sichbaeumchen.
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Pfirsichbaeumchen
12 hours ago
Camilo (baudelaire) is now an advanced contributor/ist jetzt fortgeschrittener Mitarbeiter/nun estas progresinta kontribuanto.
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odexed
2 hours ago - edited 2 hours ago
@baudelaire
¡Felicidades! Gracias por su empeño y dedicación al proyecto.
CK
CK
3 days ago - edited 22 hours ago
* New Audio Files Added (December 2016) **

The dates are based on the time in Japan.


◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ December 4, 2016

▪ arh added 306 Spanish audio files (Total 1278)
https://tatoeba.org/sentences_lists/show/6685/und

▪ CK has added 361 English audio files (Total 246224)
https://tatoeba.org/sentences_lists/show/4000/und


◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ December 1, 2016

▪ arh added 123 Spanish audio files (Total 972)
https://tatoeba.org/sentences_lists/show/6685/und

▪ CK has added 317 English audio files (Total 245863)
https://tatoeba.org/sentences_lists/show/4000/und


◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ See the previous audio contributions log on the following page.

https://tatoeba.org/eng/wall/show_message/27635



◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼

◼ Would you like to help add audio, too?
If so, please read http://bit.ly/shtooka.

◼ See all audio lists with this search.
https://tatoeba.org/sentences_l...direction:desc

You can find more detailed information about licensing and dialects on the following page.
http://bit.ly/tatoebaaudiolists

◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼ ◼
CK
CK
yesterday
** Stats - 2016-12-03 - Native Language Sentence Counts **

http://tatoeba.byethost3.com/stats-161203.html
DostKaplan
5 days ago
[BUG]

Steps to reproduce the problem:

• In the same browser (I used Google Chrome) open two tabs.
• Login to Tatoeba.
• In tab #1, select From: English To: Turkish and make a search (example: love)
• In tab #2, select From: Turkish To: Malay and make a search (example: anne)
• Go back to tab #1 and select Contribute-->Add Sentences or Community-->Wall

Problem:
Tab #1 now shows From: Turkish To: Malay, taking the language settings from tab #2!

The fix:
Each Tatoeba page should carry the language settings set within a tab to all subsequent Tatoeba pages within the same tab. In other words Tatoeba pages in each tab should retain its own language settings. Don't rely on site cookies. Carry the language settings through via hidden fields in the HTML instead. That way I don't have to keep reselecting the From/To language dropdowns whenever I go back and forth between tabs.
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CK
CK
5 days ago
One solution to your problem, I think, would be to use 2 different browsers, Firefox and Chrome, for example. Most computers nowadays would have no problem with supporting 2 browsers running at the same time.
gillux
5 days ago
> Problem:
> Tab #1 now shows From: Turkish To: Malay, taking the language settings from tab #2!

It’s not a bug, it’s a feature. :-)

You have a point, though. I like to assign a type of search for each tab, too. For the time being, you may use Firefox’s private browsing. It allows you to open one more session simultaneously with the non-private one.
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DostKaplan
4 days ago - edited 4 days ago
I'd have to disagree that it is a "feature." I feel that consistency and reasonable, expected behaviors are part of basic web page experience. Another related problem is:

1. Search for "love". I see results containing "love".
2. On that very same page, now search for "hate". I see results containing "hate".
3. Now hit the Back button on the browser. The page displays the results for "love" as expected, but the search box at the top shows "hate". Bad bad bad! It is an easy matter to keep track of this sort thing by storing pertinent info using hidden HTML fields or in <div>'s dynamically which remain intact within the page.
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gillux
2 days ago
When I say something is a feature, I mean it has been programmed this way on purpose. I’m not saying it’s good or bad. (The emoticon in my previous message was rather sarcastic, as the sentence “It’s not a bug, it’s a feature” is a popular rhetoric of developer.)

The other problem you’re describing is a feature too. On Tatoeba, on any page you open, you’ll always see the latest keywords you looked up in the search bar. Apparently, this feature has been implemented by Trang in the early days of Tatoeba (beginning of 2009) and it’s still there: https://github.com/Tatoeba/tato...c71c7e3ac31dd9
Objectivesea
2016-10-20 18:38 - edited 2016-10-20 18:41
I'm trying to link sentences across languages, but every attempt only displays an error message instead: "An error occurred while saving. Please try again or contact us to report this."

I looked at the guide (http://en.wiki.tatoeba.org/arti...tro-linking#), and the drag-and-drop method seems like it would be intuitive, but the icons shown on that page do not resemble the current Tatoeba interface. Could someone update that page, please, or offer me some idea for how to do this?
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TRANG
2016-10-20 19:27
Which sentences are you trying to link?

Aiji also reported an issue with linking, so maybe there's a bug with the feature.
https://tatoeba.org/eng/wall/sh...#message_27468

To figure out what is wrong, I will need to know more precisely what you tried to do.

The icons on the wiki are a bit different, but they are positioned at the same place, and should still work the same way.
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Objectivesea
20 days ago
For example, while trying to link French sentence #5329152 to the English sentence #2308116, I tried to drag the blue arrow from the left of the French sentence onto the diagonal paper-clip or chain icon above the English sentence.

Thinking it might be a problem specific to my OS, I've tried to link sentences both from my home Macintosh and from my PC at work. In both cases, I got only the error message:

"An error occurred while saving. Please try again or contact us to report this."
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CK
CK
20 days ago
If the arrow is blue, then they are already linked, aren't they?
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Objectivesea
17 days ago
Thanks to CK for sending a clear graphic that made linking understandable even to my thick old head. I was able to relink Pfirsichbaeumchen's sentence with no trouble.

Previously I had formed exactly the opposite of the right idea as to the interpretation of the icons. I was thinking that the scissors meant the current state, as opposed to the result that would follow from clicking on it. Somehow, I had thought that the presence of the scissors icon meant that the sentence was currently unlinked and that I must click on that icon to link it. This, of course, had the effect of unlinking a perfectly good existing link, as well as creating an error message.

In my ignorance, I was creating as much chaos as a driver arriving at a red traffic light and thinking that it must mean "go." My apologies to all.
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sacredceltic
10 days ago - edited 9 days ago
The content of this message goes against our rules and was therefore hidden. It is displayed only to admins and to the author of the message.
AlanF_US
9 days ago - edited 9 days ago
This post on a usability forum relates to the kind of problem you're talking about, namely whether a toggle button should show the system's current state or the state to which it should change:

http://ux.stackexchange.com/que...h-it-will-chan

I found the discussion pretty interesting.
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sacredceltic
8 days ago - edited 8 days ago
the correct way to avoid such a mess in the future is the following :

1) Check that a contributor UNDERSTANDS the UI before granting them the privilege to destroy other contributors' patient work.

2) add tooltips to the linking/unlinking buttons clearly explaining what they mean and do.
Objectivesea
8 days ago - edited 7 days ago
Thanks to AlanF for the link to the very interesting discussion at the user interface design forum; it helps clarify things, and it may offer some help to our tireless programmer TRANG if it is something that could be implemented without too much difficulty.

Thanks also to sacredceltic for the helpful suggestion of a tooltip, something that could display on hovering over the icons in question (assuming that this would not appreciably slow down the response time of the website.)

Also, if sacredceltic really feels that my overall efforts here are destructive, I have no objection if the Tatoeba community were to reduce my status from Advanced Contributor to that of an ordinary Contributor or, in extremis, were to ban me from further contributions to the site. I bear no ill will to anyone, and I wish only for peace to all.
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AlanF_US
7 days ago
I wrote an issue ticket regarding the suggestion of tooltips:

https://github.com/Tatoeba/tatoeba2/issues/1365
TRANG
3 days ago
We actually had a regression, which went unnoticed. There used to be tooltips on the link/unlink icons.

I tested on an older version of Firefox (Firefox 41) and the tooltips are displayed. But on the newer version (Firefox 50), the tooltips are no longer displayed. I'm not sure since which version this changed exactly, and what is the behavior for other versions of other browsers.

But this issue is easy to fix and will be fixed on the next Tatoeba update, this weekend.

> I have no objection if the Tatoeba community were to reduce my status
> from Advanced Contributor to that of an ordinary Contributor or, in
> extremis, were to ban me from further contributions to the site.

Let's not over-dramatize, as humans we all make mistakes. As long as you understand how the UI works now, we're completely fine.
sacredceltic
8 days ago - edited 8 days ago
so you have unlinked, since the time you became an advanced contributor, dozens or even hundreds of patiently elaborated translations that were perfectly valid like here https://tatoeba.org/fra/sentences/show/1042481
This is absolutely shameful and I DEMAND that you immediately relink them ALL.
You are not proficient in French and you don't know the meaning of what you read in this language, so PLEASE STOP linking or unlinking translations in this language !
I don't get why you became an advanced contributor, which enabled you to destroy the work of other contributors !
Why on earth is the mastery of languages and the understanding of the service UI not a prerequisite to becoming advanced contributor ? That is beyond me !
CK
CK
3 days ago
A note to those who have recorded audio for the Tatoeba Project.

The following is a list of most members who have contributed audio. (I need to update it a bit, so a few new contributors are not yet listed.)

Lists of Who Recorded Which Audio
http://bit.ly/tatoebaaudiolists

Perhaps some of you would like to choose a Creative Commons license which would allow use of your audio files in projects other than tatoeba.org. The CC-BY-NC (attribution, non-commericial) seems to be the most popular choice with our contributors.

If you would be willing to offer your audio this way, please let me know via https://tatoeba.org/eng/private_messages/write/CK.

arh
arh
4 days ago
Sugerencias para fomentar la aportación de contribuciones orales:
La página de destino de la ruta [ https://tatoeba.org/spa/sentences/with_audio ] muestra siempre la parte del listado más antigua, por lo que los usuarios que llegan aquí pueden creer que no hay actividad.
Sugiero que, por defecto, se muestre la página más reciente, de modo que los usuarios vean que hay novedades y se animen a contribuir también.
Quizá podrían añadirse opciones, como hay en otras páginas, para ordenar las frases según se desee.
Por otro lado, propongo algún tipo de recordatorio, parecido al existente para las aportaciones escritas titulado [ Contribuyendo actualmente - Usuarios que participaron en las últimas 200 contribuciones ]. Si la gente es consciente de que otros están añadiendo voz a las frases, quizá se animarían a hacer lo mismo. Para facilitarlo, sugiero también trabajar paulatinamente en la aplicación Shtooka para que sea una herramienta más intuitiva.

---

Suggestions for voice contribution encouragement:
The landing page for route [ https://tatoeba.org/eng/sentences/with_audio ] always shows the same old part of the list, which may lead the users to think that there is no activity here.
I suggest that, by default, the last modified page be shown, so that users be aware of the activity and may be encouraged to contribute themselves.
Perhaps, arranging options similar to those in other pages could be added, to let users arrange the list in their preferred way.
On the other hand, I suggest to include some kind of reminder, similar to the one existing for text contributions named [ Currently contributing - Users who participated in the last 200 contributions ]. If people realize that others are adding voice to the phrases, they may be also attracted to do likewise. To facilitate this, I also recommend to steadily work on the Shtooka application so that it becomes a more user-friendly tool.
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CK
CK
4 days ago - edited 4 days ago
At this time, the only way to really see what new audio files are being added is to use this URL.

https://tatoeba.org/eng/sentenc...direction:desc
CK's lists containing "audio -"
Sorted on "last updated"

You can click any of the lists and see the most-recently added audio files by any of these contributors at the beginning of their lists.


You can also browse the newest sentences, limited to those with audio.

For example, ...

https://tatoeba.org/sentences/s...nly-with-audio
All sentences in English with audio

https://tatoeba.org/sentences/s...nly-with-audio
All sentences in Spanish with audio

These will not necessarily be the newest audio files, since new audio is also being added to older sentences.
sharptoothed
5 days ago
** Sentences & Translations Stats **

These stats have been updated:

http://tatoeba.j-langtools.com/transtop/

Graphs have been updated, too.

http://tatoeba.j-langtools.com/graphs.html
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CK
CK
5 days ago - edited 5 days ago
** Stats - 2016-11-26 - The Number of English Sentences Translated Into Other Languages, Limited to Languages that Have Identified Native Speakers **

http://tatoeba.byethost3.com/stats-161126b.html

This compares the percentage of English sentences translated (as shown in Sharptoothed's data) with the percentage of sentences with audio that have translations owned by native speakers and the percentage of sentences on List 907 that have translations owned by native speakers.
Guybrush88
5 days ago
thanks
odexed
5 days ago
I think there is a mistake in the Russian interface. When I write somebody a message, the first field should be "Кому" (To) and not "язык перевода". In English, it's the same "To" as above when you set the target language (Search From - To). In Russian this field should have a different name.

http://i.imgur.com/vinEg1m.png?1

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sharptoothed
5 days ago
This is because the same English string "To" is used in both places. Localisation mechanism uses English strings as keys, so to fix the problem some other string should be used for labelling "To" message header (for example, "To:").
sacredceltic
2016-11-01 12:54 - edited 2016-11-01 12:54
*** réforme du palmarès des langues ***

Le palmarès par nombre de phrases a montré ses limites puisque certains sont prêts à écrire n'importe quoi dans une langue pour qu'elle figure en haut du palmarès. Celui-ci ne tient aucun compte de la qualité de ces phrases ou de la popularité de ces phrases auprès des traducteurs.
Aussi, je propose que la palmarès représente désormais, non pas le nombre de phrases, qui ne représente rien aux yeux d'une communauté de traducteurs, mais le taux de traduction d'une langue.
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sacredceltic
7 days ago
Au vu de la qualité lamentable de certaines phrases, je remets ce sujet CRUCIAL à l'ordre du jour...
Aiji
5 days ago
En ce qui concerne le palmarès que vous voulez mettre en place, je pense qu'il s'agit des stats de traductions que sharptoothed partage régulièrement (il vient de poster ses dernières stats à l'heure où j'écris ces lignes), c'est bien cela ?
Vous voudriez que ce soit ce palmarès qui soit affiché ?

Je pense que chaque classement (je préfère ça à palmarès...) a son intérêt auprès de personnes différentes, qui utilisent ou utiliseront toutes l'outil pour différentes choses. A partir de là, quel palmarès affiché n'est pas un point si crucial je pense. Mais ça se débat, c'est sûr.

Par contre du coup, je suis bien plus intéressé par ce que vous dites quant à la production de phrases et la qualité de celles-ci. Vous qui défendez souvent que toute phrase (correcte) se doit d'être respectée, pourriez-vous étayer votre propos et préciser ce que vous entendez par "phrase à la qualité lamentable" ?
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sacredceltic
5 days ago
Non, je parle de Tatoeba : la page d'accueil qui montre le palmarés des langues et affiche les 5 premiers drapeaux.
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