Et je vois que le problème le plus fréquent ce sont les gens qui traduisent depuis une langue qui n'est pas celle qu'ils voulaient traduire.
Je fais la proposition suivante à sysko: Tout nouvel utilisateur devrait avoir une sorte de compteur, mettons pour les 20 premières traductions qu'il effectue. Pour ces premières traductions, un pop-up/message serait surimprimé lorsqu'ils cliqueraient sur le bouton de traduction, en indiquant: "Vous vous apprêtez à traduire cette phrase depuis la langue xxxx. Est-ce bien une langue que vous connaissez et que vous voulez traduire ? Sinon, merci d'annuler et de cliquer sur la version de la phrase dans la langue que vous voulez traduire, afin de la sélectionner (elle doit apparaître en premier) avant de cliquer de nouveau sur le bouton de traduction. Tatoeba est un système de traduction d'une langue à l'autre <lien vers plus d'explication dans le guide du contributeur>"

Puis, au bout de 20 traductions, le message n'apparaîtrait plus et ne risquerait pas d'ennuyer les traducteurs déjà avertis.

Je crois que ça aiderait beaucoup...

oui c'est une très bonne idée: Un répertoire des questions/problèmes fréquents.

comme je disais, c'est super et je vais pouvoir les renvoyer à cette référence, mais tu sais bien que ça suffit pas, il faut donner des explications à ceux qui ne lisent pas ou bien n'ont pas compris malgré la lecture. Il y en a, tu es obligé de ré-expliquer en détail plusieurs fois...Demande à Muiriel qui a eu cette expérience récemment...

ben tu vois, j'ai répondu à des hongrois, beaucoup de germanophones, des hispanophones...

Koran dankon kaj gratulon Muiriel kaj GrizaLeono!

Etant donné le grand nombre d'espérantistes qui sont nouvellement arrivés sur Tatoeba, de nombreux problèmes se posent parce qu'aucun modérateur n'est espérantiste et la plupart d'entre eux ne parlent pas anglais ou français, russe, japonais ou chinois qui sont les langues principales connues des modérateurs. La situation n'est pas tenable. Il y a de nombreux contributeurs qui traduisent des langues qu'ils ne comprennent pas parce qu'ils ne comprennent pas les principes de Tatoeba et n'ont pas lu ou ne savent pas lire les instructions.
Il est donc non seulement urgent d'afficher les instructions en espéranto mais aussi d'enrôler des modérateurs espérantophones.

you'resoprepsterousandimperialist!Itisjustappallin!

And so? I'd do exactly the same! Why should Englishprevailin international institution?

oh yeah?
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad...ran.C3.A7aises

"« Art. 11. - Les termes et expressions publiés au Journal officiel sont obligatoirement utilisés à la place des termes et expressions équivalents en langues étrangères"

I am not the one to call this Globish. I didn't coin that word, as evidenced by my references below and contrary to what Demetrius asserted. Globish on Tatoeba is the result of thousands of daily bad-English contributions, by early-learners, and by initial imports of broken-English by Japanese learners. It ends up being what it is today. A big pot of you-name-it full of duplicates. I don't call this English. it is not, although much English might be included in it.
I don't see why calling this mess "Globish" would be inflammatory since Brits call it that.

And, yes, I have an opinion, and I don't call you names as you do me. You're just a rude person.

> You say 'Globish' is ridicule, and you say the sentences on Tatoeba are 'Globish'.

No, I never said that. I wrote a few were...Especially phrases of non-English languages that are systematically peppered with useless and laughable anglicisms.

>so I'm sure there must be some misunderstanding here.

Yes, yours. If you read me correctly instead of calling me names...
You shouldn't mingle in conversations of other people when you don't grasp them.
Actually I respect the English language as much as any other, up to the point that it is actually my second language. I read and write daily in this language. I just deplore that people use it in the wrong way and at the wrong place, for no other purpose than sounding "cool".

tsss tsss...small player!

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globish

I swear I didn't write this article...

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/...t-globish.html

I'm so honoured that a word I am the only one to use makes it in the New York Times and the title of such a famous book ^^

Nevertheless, French & German courts deal daily with internet issues, including social networks, web translation, etc...and they pronounce statements in languages that are not globish. Doing so, they do exactly what they've done for centuries with other registers. I don't see a difference. See you in 20 years and we'll have a good laugh at it.
I have a good one for you: Lately, the phrase "low-cost" has surfaced in France to refer to airlines such as Ryan Air and means "à prix réduit". Most French pronounce it "low coast", though, which makes it totally absurd.
I bet with you 1000€ that French Law will still refer to "à prix réduit" and will not have adopted "low-cost" in 20 years. A bet?

And it is already written into Law...with official language.

Well, the French live under these rules since Louis the XIVth and have not deemed necessary to change its fundamentals across a revolution, 2 empires and 5 republics. I think this generation won't either.
We still continue writing ever more laws and contracts and everybody seems happy with that. Actually, I know of no political party or any civic initiative in France advocating the abolition of written Law, the mandatory education in the official language or the Académie. 67 millions of people agreeing on this should be significant enough, don't you think?
Maybe all the world doesn't need to abide by Gordon Brown's principles...

Germany and many other countries also have a written Law and subsequently have "official language" definitions and institutions.
Now, if other languages verge on self-destruction through globishisation, that is their speakers' problem, not mine, indeed.

But it is not the question. Today's youngsters who don't understand how French evolution proceeds will understand it in the course of their life and career.
What you must understand, which makes French fundamentally different from English, is that French Law is written and English Law is not, English law is based on precedence.
And Law is about everything, including sending emails. So everything is inscribed into Law.
So Law defines the language in France, that is subsequently used to govern and administer France, and percolates into business, education, etc...That is precisely why the French state founded the Académie, to help civil servants to define the language as unambiguously as possible.
Eventually, a majority of the population uses the official language because school with official curriculum in official French is mandatory in France and we're not going to use 2 different French when we also want to learn other languages.
Kids are very fine, but they represent a small (and decreasing) fraction of the population and eventually, they will also have to write and abide by contracts written in official French that they have to learn at school anyway.
The problem with contracts is, if their wordings are ambiguous, it makes them void. That is why, ambiguous words and spellings don't usually make it through to the official language. "email" is ambiguous, that is why all references recommend "e-mail"/"courriel"/"mél".
Of course, in informal language such as chat (which is also another ambiguity in French with cat), it is OK because the context is set. But it is bad habit for learners to study informal chat, because it won't help you at work when you need to write unambiguous reports and make speeches in front of audiences who are not part of your subculture.
Not being able to make yourself unambiguously understood by the largest number is a basic mistake, since language is about communication. Or what else ?

No, because youngsters don't make the language. There is an administration, Law, Courts, commercial contracts, etc...And these have more weight on the language, as history shows in the case of French.
Eventually, the French that becomes mainstreet is the French that will be acknowledged by authorities, whether you like or not. Sometimes, kids words make it through, but only when they are unambiguous and don't contradict the language pronunciation principles.

> Not that I think that's great, but it's the price of globalization. In a million years or so, there might only be a single major language.

I agree, and the natural selection rules dictates that this unique language will be the most efficient. Thus:

1) Everybody will be able to pronounce it naturally across the world.
2) it will be possible to write words unambiguously from hearing
3) It will be possible to pronounce words unambiguously from writing.
4) it will be possible for everybody to coin new non-ambiguous words from simple rules
5) it will be possible for everybody to decode new words naturally and unambiguously.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1spqX4sIDo

Well, maybe you're just too ignorant?
Yes, the excessive use of (usually bad) English and its ridiculous peppering in all other languages, regardless of theses languages own pronunciation rules or homophones, by people who find it cool to show off their English and subsequently forget the corresponding words in their own language, is called Globishisation. I live in Brussels, the EU Capital, and even the English call it that here. The euro-English that is spoken here is appalling and rejected with disdain by the English people themselves. As a matter of fact, since English has no official reference and is based on usage, English is transformed by globalisation with inconsistent influences of bad-English from all over the world, resulting in what the English themselves call "Globish". I learnt that very word from an English person myself. So in fact, the English have been entirely dispossessed of their own language. Former Prime Minister Gordon Brown declared that Great Britain (actually England, as he forgot that other languages exist in other parts of Great Britain...you're not alone to be ignorant, obviously, if it can be of any help...) "granted" this wonderful creation to the world. Well thank you, but, now that even English people don't make this mess out anymore...
I think it is a high level Scandinavian minister who ridiculed herself the most, despite probably 20 years of English-education, when she declared to journalists that she was "at the start of her period" when she meant her "mandate". Globish is indeed ridicule.